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	<title>Comments on: Bil 3arabi: Kaman marra</title>
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	<pubDate>Fri, 29 Aug 2008 22:49:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: obi</title>
		<link>http://www.tololy.com/2005/12/18/bil-3arabi-kaman-marra/#comment-6192</link>
		<dc:creator>obi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:19:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tololy.com/?p=153#comment-6192</guid>
		<description>hi</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hi</p>
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		<title>By: Samir</title>
		<link>http://www.tololy.com/2005/12/18/bil-3arabi-kaman-marra/#comment-832</link>
		<dc:creator>Samir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Dec 2005 07:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tololy.com/?p=153#comment-832</guid>
		<description>I've looked up and studied a psychology paper on trilingualisim for my psychology class at university. It used 12 families as samples, and it talks about language mixing for a page.

It mentions the lingual background of the parents as a factor. Parents that were monolingual were more likely to correct or translate for the child when language mixing occured. On the other hand, bilingual parents didn't mind and sometimes encouraged children to mix languages (inderectly, by mixing languages themselves).

I will understand no english when my son talks to me ...

Also, children that attended a local mono-lingual school were less likely to mix languages.

I think I am proud to say that I can speak only Arabic when the crowd needs so. Since my dad is not fond of english, I was allowed to only mix German with Arabic, which I actually did, and sometimes still do...  but my friends require a non-German Arabic, I ended up speaking clean Arabic. 

I find alot of trouble talking to my father about my studies, or the projects I'm planning to work on, since all our engineering books are in english..   I tend to switch all english when me and friends explain things for each other or talk ideas, but when I have to speak all arabic about "Tell us about the design process".. I will be in alot of trouble!

On a different note, Arabizi is similar to the problem in India (I think), I watched an indian movie once, and they spoke english a third of the time! I wonder what India thinks and is doing about this phenomenon.

Good day to you, interesting post!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve looked up and studied a psychology paper on trilingualisim for my psychology class at university. It used 12 families as samples, and it talks about language mixing for a page.</p>
<p>It mentions the lingual background of the parents as a factor. Parents that were monolingual were more likely to correct or translate for the child when language mixing occured. On the other hand, bilingual parents didn&#8217;t mind and sometimes encouraged children to mix languages (inderectly, by mixing languages themselves).</p>
<p>I will understand no english when my son talks to me &#8230;</p>
<p>Also, children that attended a local mono-lingual school were less likely to mix languages.</p>
<p>I think I am proud to say that I can speak only Arabic when the crowd needs so. Since my dad is not fond of english, I was allowed to only mix German with Arabic, which I actually did, and sometimes still do&#8230;  but my friends require a non-German Arabic, I ended up speaking clean Arabic. </p>
<p>I find alot of trouble talking to my father about my studies, or the projects I&#8217;m planning to work on, since all our engineering books are in english..   I tend to switch all english when me and friends explain things for each other or talk ideas, but when I have to speak all arabic about &#8220;Tell us about the design process&#8221;.. I will be in alot of trouble!</p>
<p>On a different note, Arabizi is similar to the problem in India (I think), I watched an indian movie once, and they spoke english a third of the time! I wonder what India thinks and is doing about this phenomenon.</p>
<p>Good day to you, interesting post!</p>
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		<title>By: Silencer</title>
		<link>http://www.tololy.com/2005/12/18/bil-3arabi-kaman-marra/#comment-831</link>
		<dc:creator>Silencer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Dec 2005 23:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tololy.com/?p=153#comment-831</guid>
		<description>hey Abu sinan!

i doubt any of the well-off educated jordanians speak english or arabizi to show off about anything.... the only people who try to show off any knowledge of arabic are the really poor people who picked up a few words.. they keep annoying me with their english greetings (i'm jordanian but i look like i'm russian or something).

i think they might be losing their arabic, and they spend their lives watching english tv, english movies, reading in english, internet's in english.. classes in many highschools are now in english.. and that kind of thing. 

maybe i should start a movement to bring back fus7a!
i love fus7a.. im hoping to get real good at it and speak it all the time ... would be funny to shout at "arabizi" speakers in classical arabic. and i dont mean modern day newspaper-style classical arabic. i mean words from the the middle ages and before. 

but seriously (well, that was partly serious), i'm more worried about the loss of classical arabic than i am about the loss of colloqial. May God always keep the majority of the arabs poor, so that there are always people who actually remember God and always people who speak arabic!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hey Abu sinan!</p>
<p>i doubt any of the well-off educated jordanians speak english or arabizi to show off about anything&#8230;. the only people who try to show off any knowledge of arabic are the really poor people who picked up a few words.. they keep annoying me with their english greetings (i&#8217;m jordanian but i look like i&#8217;m russian or something).</p>
<p>i think they might be losing their arabic, and they spend their lives watching english tv, english movies, reading in english, internet&#8217;s in english.. classes in many highschools are now in english.. and that kind of thing. </p>
<p>maybe i should start a movement to bring back fus7a!<br />
i love fus7a.. im hoping to get real good at it and speak it all the time &#8230; would be funny to shout at &#8220;arabizi&#8221; speakers in classical arabic. and i dont mean modern day newspaper-style classical arabic. i mean words from the the middle ages and before. </p>
<p>but seriously (well, that was partly serious), i&#8217;m more worried about the loss of classical arabic than i am about the loss of colloqial. May God always keep the majority of the arabs poor, so that there are always people who actually remember God and always people who speak arabic!</p>
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		<title>By: Furat</title>
		<link>http://www.tololy.com/2005/12/18/bil-3arabi-kaman-marra/#comment-830</link>
		<dc:creator>Furat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Dec 2005 22:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tololy.com/?p=153#comment-830</guid>
		<description>My collogues the debaters, with the grace of the Box owner  Toly ,to go on, and ask you kindly to do so and pitch in your opinions.
 It  is not the credibility of the source ,as much as it is a fact that Arabizi is taking place ,hopefully as a fad like all fashions may go as fast as it comes. 
What is troubling me, I can’t help but repeat myself! One of the questions in ‘Arabizi’ is why we don’t use living languages WHY? Why do some young people find it easier to express themselves in English?? Some said it’s a more versatile modern hip language compared to Arabic which is too dramatic and poetic… some said it’s part of the cultural and economic invasion of globalization (the over-used cliché, blame it on globalization, or the great conspiracy)! Some condemn the fact that sciences are taught in English at our universities, and professors explain it in Arabic, so this creates the duality in use of language! the core of the problem our Arab specking world suffers enough factors to defeat us from advances to stand and stop a  growing fad to go out of proportions ,the answer to a problem is to face it, we need to work on our mother tongue ,and same on all other  languages that open doors ,and not enforce isolation by creating walls of cotton . 

None of this would change the energy and thoughts we put into Arabic or other languages, again, because I love the idea of crossing borders and overcoming the language barriers!! It’s just that Arabizi disturbed me as means of isolation .Take Chinese language in 10 years to come with the economic invasion, world wide elementary schools started teaching Chinese to give an edge for smart enterprising student ,it is not the Arabizi  ,that will stand the future  economic challenges or allow us to read sources that are not available except  in translation .
Again ,I am to be corrected ,if I find other points or means that may have passed ,as I look for the work of time languages legitimate ones that took mankind stumbling block of years to reach us ,for a reason to communicate effectively with others than our reagions .
I beg ,Tololy’s Box a pardon for taking this space as  a podium of debate for such a vital issue .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My collogues the debaters, with the grace of the Box owner  Toly ,to go on, and ask you kindly to do so and pitch in your opinions.<br />
 It  is not the credibility of the source ,as much as it is a fact that Arabizi is taking place ,hopefully as a fad like all fashions may go as fast as it comes.<br />
What is troubling me, I can’t help but repeat myself! One of the questions in ‘Arabizi’ is why we don’t use living languages WHY? Why do some young people find it easier to express themselves in English?? Some said it’s a more versatile modern hip language compared to Arabic which is too dramatic and poetic… some said it’s part of the cultural and economic invasion of globalization (the over-used cliché, blame it on globalization, or the great conspiracy)! Some condemn the fact that sciences are taught in English at our universities, and professors explain it in Arabic, so this creates the duality in use of language! the core of the problem our Arab specking world suffers enough factors to defeat us from advances to stand and stop a  growing fad to go out of proportions ,the answer to a problem is to face it, we need to work on our mother tongue ,and same on all other  languages that open doors ,and not enforce isolation by creating walls of cotton . </p>
<p>None of this would change the energy and thoughts we put into Arabic or other languages, again, because I love the idea of crossing borders and overcoming the language barriers!! It’s just that Arabizi disturbed me as means of isolation .Take Chinese language in 10 years to come with the economic invasion, world wide elementary schools started teaching Chinese to give an edge for smart enterprising student ,it is not the Arabizi  ,that will stand the future  economic challenges or allow us to read sources that are not available except  in translation .<br />
Again ,I am to be corrected ,if I find other points or means that may have passed ,as I look for the work of time languages legitimate ones that took mankind stumbling block of years to reach us ,for a reason to communicate effectively with others than our reagions .<br />
I beg ,Tololy’s Box a pardon for taking this space as  a podium of debate for such a vital issue .</p>
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		<title>By: Abu Sinan</title>
		<link>http://www.tololy.com/2005/12/18/bil-3arabi-kaman-marra/#comment-829</link>
		<dc:creator>Abu Sinan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Dec 2005 20:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tololy.com/?p=153#comment-829</guid>
		<description>You see this stuff a lot in the West.  Arabs who come here try so hard to be "more American than the Americans" but often fail miserably and just end up looking like idiots.

  Now I mix English and Arabic, but being that I have just been speaking Arabic for a few years now, that is normal.  Here in the USA you get kids born in the Middle East who cannot speak more than a few words of Arabic and certainly cannot read or write it.

  I see this as being a class issue as well.  I think many Arabs in the Middle East do this as a way to sort of show their education, their "western", hence monied, credentials.

  I have seen this theme in many countries and on many blogs.  Those who have not had the opportunity, or the wish, to travel and school abroad, against those who have, and those who use this fact to seem superior to others.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You see this stuff a lot in the West.  Arabs who come here try so hard to be &#8220;more American than the Americans&#8221; but often fail miserably and just end up looking like idiots.</p>
<p>  Now I mix English and Arabic, but being that I have just been speaking Arabic for a few years now, that is normal.  Here in the USA you get kids born in the Middle East who cannot speak more than a few words of Arabic and certainly cannot read or write it.</p>
<p>  I see this as being a class issue as well.  I think many Arabs in the Middle East do this as a way to sort of show their education, their &#8220;western&#8221;, hence monied, credentials.</p>
<p>  I have seen this theme in many countries and on many blogs.  Those who have not had the opportunity, or the wish, to travel and school abroad, against those who have, and those who use this fact to seem superior to others.</p>
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		<title>By: Tololy</title>
		<link>http://www.tololy.com/2005/12/18/bil-3arabi-kaman-marra/#comment-828</link>
		<dc:creator>Tololy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Dec 2005 20:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tololy.com/?p=153#comment-828</guid>
		<description>This is a beautiful debate, I'm in love!

I do not want to monopolize the scene by responding to each and every comment. I respect all opinions and I think all points are valid, in varying degrees. 

My only response goes out to Rami Abdelrahman, you are right in some points you make. The number of people using this new lingo is marginal compared to the overall population of Jordan, true. But what this new lingo does is widen the social gaps we already have, and some suffer from. Whether this is inevitable or not is not my business to judge. 

As for the authenticity of the article, I received the link as is, and made no investigations about its origin. The material it presents is valid enough in my views, even if not authentic. Should that upset anyone, I apologize.

Arabic texts attract Arabic readers, positive. Italian texts attract Italian readers and enthusiasts, true, and so is the case with every other language. 

English, on the other hand, would attract people from Africa, the Arab world, Japan, and Sweden, to name but a few places in a random fashion. Does this mean the whole world should blog in English and abandon every other language? I'd like to think otherwise.

Do not mistake this for a rejection of the English language, I love that language, but what I am trying to make clear is that -accessibility aside- Arabic is by no means less valuable, and never less beautiful.

Again, if I come too direct in a repulsive manner, I take that hint of an attitude back. You speak Arabic, excellent, what sort? I did not mean to accuse you of having an "identity crisis", if that term does not find your liking them by all means you do not have to tolerate it. I was clearly talking about my own opinion in people, such as myself, who mingle Arabi and English when they speak. That is, if I enlarge the linguistic issue to fit a bigger frame. Most people who use "Arabizi" think they know exactly who they are, no identity crisis whatsoever, and that is brilliant, it works for me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a beautiful debate, I&#8217;m in love!</p>
<p>I do not want to monopolize the scene by responding to each and every comment. I respect all opinions and I think all points are valid, in varying degrees. </p>
<p>My only response goes out to Rami Abdelrahman, you are right in some points you make. The number of people using this new lingo is marginal compared to the overall population of Jordan, true. But what this new lingo does is widen the social gaps we already have, and some suffer from. Whether this is inevitable or not is not my business to judge. </p>
<p>As for the authenticity of the article, I received the link as is, and made no investigations about its origin. The material it presents is valid enough in my views, even if not authentic. Should that upset anyone, I apologize.</p>
<p>Arabic texts attract Arabic readers, positive. Italian texts attract Italian readers and enthusiasts, true, and so is the case with every other language. </p>
<p>English, on the other hand, would attract people from Africa, the Arab world, Japan, and Sweden, to name but a few places in a random fashion. Does this mean the whole world should blog in English and abandon every other language? I&#8217;d like to think otherwise.</p>
<p>Do not mistake this for a rejection of the English language, I love that language, but what I am trying to make clear is that -accessibility aside- Arabic is by no means less valuable, and never less beautiful.</p>
<p>Again, if I come too direct in a repulsive manner, I take that hint of an attitude back. You speak Arabic, excellent, what sort? I did not mean to accuse you of having an &#8220;identity crisis&#8221;, if that term does not find your liking them by all means you do not have to tolerate it. I was clearly talking about my own opinion in people, such as myself, who mingle Arabi and English when they speak. That is, if I enlarge the linguistic issue to fit a bigger frame. Most people who use &#8220;Arabizi&#8221; think they know exactly who they are, no identity crisis whatsoever, and that is brilliant, it works for me.</p>
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