During class yesterday, a fellow student told me about a man who proposed to her. She said he told her “I am very ambitious and very achieving. What are your ambitions?” She told him she wanted to get a PhD (although in reality she doesn’t, but she was testing the waters so to speak), to which he said “A PhD?! I don’t like a woman who has many degrees.”
I felt disgusted and made a joke about that cave-dweller who boasted he had a 2008 model Mercedes. The girl even told the whole class about him, complete with his full name, and we all laughed and had a good time at his retarded expense. I have heard it and seen it time and again how many men in this society have a “thing” against highly educated women, how they would rather snatch a Tawjihi student instead of an MA degree holder.
It’s not only about the age of the Tawjihi student (a ripe, young girl), but also about her qualifications. In the minds and culture of these men, a younger woman with less education is far more obedient than a well educated one. They believe that they can shape and mould this younger, less educated wife as they please, while the other will most definitely be difficult to tame. By this token, they don’t think of their potential wives as partners but more as inferior servants who must, at all times, remain inferior. They will not opt for the ones that might equal or compete with them in education or other qualifications. It makes them less men (as if they are men to start with).
The question I have always had concerning this practice in Jordan is: how insecure can these men possibly get? Obviously, they feel threatened by a woman’s qualifications. They want to lord over their marital households not only because they are men (the classical justification for their superiority complex), but also because they are in fact better educated and therefore better breadwinners which adds an economical value to their social status.
Read these bits from an article by Linda Hindi of The Jordan Times:
Gender equality should be priority for economic development - UN
Gender equality
UN member states regard gender equality as an essential factor for the achievement of its priorities of peace and security, human rights and development, including the Millennium Development Goals.
* Investing in women and girls has a multiplier effect on productivity, efficiency and sustained economic growth. Educated women have more economic opportunities and engage more fully in public life.
* Women who are educated tend to have fewer and healthier children, and those children are more likely to attend school. Education also increases the ability of women and girls to protect themselves against HIV.
* Women make long-ranging contributions to poverty eradication and development.
* According to World Bank estimates, an increase of one percentage point in the share of women with secondary education is associated with a 0.3 percentage point increase in per capita income.
* Educated, healthy women are more able to undertake productive activities and earn higher incomes. Investments in women, the primary caretakers of the future generation, provide returns for decades. Better educated women are able to benefit from new technologies and the opportunities presented by economic change.
* Increasing women’s access to land, credit and other resources increases their well-being, and that of their families and communities and reduces the risks of poverty.
Oh, and the student in my class rejected that caveman’s sorry ass, in case you are wondering.
She didn’t go for the benz? hmmm…I’m not sure if thats the best choice honestly,not in these times.<br /><br />I always quote my barber on this subject "I took her 17 years old barabeeha 3a 2iday, I tell her this is the place for the ashtray..and thats where the ashtray always stays..she never moves it an inch.."<br /><br />Since I’m his regular customer..maybe his ideas will get implanted in my brain someday..except that I don’t smoke.<br /><br />
The sad bit is the women who buy into this mentality… a colleague of mine from college said she doesn’t want to get a Masters degree because then it becomes more difficult to find a husband!!
It’s like this everywhere. Here, more Arab girls are getting educated, however, after they graduate it’s not the education that bothers the men. It is HOW MUCH MORE MONEY THEY MAKE THAN THEM!<br /><br />Men should be happy that he is going to marry a girl who is educated, can make lots of money, and they can live A VERY GOOD LIFE! Men just don’t get it at all!<br />
That is all unfortunate to hear, although it is not the first time I have heard something like that or saw it happen in front of me. Men like to "think" they have a sense of authority and some will try to attain that by any means. It is laughable, really, the levels some people stoop to in order to cater to their needs. <br /><br />It serves him right to get rejected! :)<br />
well…what can i say…i had my MBA before i got married, may thats why i stayed at my parents till i was 26 which worried my aunt, she thought nobody will marry me coz u know …my degree…but i got married and am the mother of 2 now and am working on my PhD, yet we as women we have always to put that extra effort to make the man feel special, to compensate for our guilt, and to always try to feel that we r may be a little bit the equal…….will that ever happen??????????????
, - No offense, but thats the craziest thing anyone can do!!<br /><br />Maybe as well, she can tell him that she has a dick, to test him if he is sympathetic to homosexuality… And then maybe later, she can inject herself with HIV and tell him, to test him if he would still love her that she is HIV positive!!<br /><br />Seriously, you don’t test someone with something you don’t want to do… But something you want to do! Daah!<br />
I don’t really get it! For me a smart educated woman is way more turn on than a -sorry to say- 18 year old cow! In fact, IF I was in a position that I end up with an under educated women (There’s no way in hell I would, though) but IF I did, there’s no way that I will allow her to continue to be uneducated! Intelligence of course is a different matter. </p>
<p>I don’t know why but "smart" is my #1 turn on, not beauty. </p>
<p>Sadly though, many girls would opt to turn the light of their minds off and go for the rich dude. In fact, he will find a better girl than your friend.</p>
<p>You know, my own parents had asymmetric qualifications! My mom with two masters while my father never graduated high school! And he is the one who pushed her to get her masters!</p>
<p>But, I still will not call this guy a caveman. This is a guy who knows what he wants. He’s out to get it. No body can blame him for it. It’s the duty of the parents to make sure their daughters are not sold to the dudes with mercedes, although, sadly, many will</p>
I will for with a PHD woman any day except is she is a nerd. Things are achanging now, with the tough economic life we have now two bread winners are better than one.Plus who would want to spend his life time with a wife talking only thousand ways of using hummus or eggplant or gold price. Dah dah huh huh. If she can make more money I will change diapers and set the table ,heck I will cook too. I will also borrow her mercedes once in a while to show off. My ideal wife is the one who can intelligently discuss and converse and do the treaturous household financial math too. Educated couples have longer happier marriages and wider social circles plus they do give each other quality times and quality space too.
choosing a woman with less education is not something wrong but a matter of choice ts like going to the mall and buying things that suits u. same thing goes for women who choose rich men, which is matter of believes. both have certain believes that he/she is conviced with and acting according to it. imagin the same situation with a girl who asked a guy who propsed to her what kinda car u have or do u even own a house, what would that be ? is she threatened by something ? and yeah here comes the victims . women are always victimized by men. men are evil, they are eating their rights. bla bla bla… come on look what is happening in the world, women are taking their place in the world and u still talk about men are bigs. i remember one incident that happened with me before i got my car, i used to take the bus, and everyone know who’s it like on it. bus drivers tend to overload the bus with extra passengers, so a girl got on and there was no seat for her, so she stood beside me and stared at me as if she’s saying " get the hell up, and let me sit" u’re expexting things to be ur way. Hello welcome to the real world, u’ll be shut and treated like hell, not coz u’re women but thats how people treat each other. and people who treat others like that are horrible PEOPLE not Horrible MEN. its a retard to make accusations and generlizations to all men. There is no Jareyat anymore, no one can put a leach on anybody. unless u let them and thats another case..
What’s with this entire obsession about the high level of education, a woman can be the most educated person on earth and she still fails to maintain an intimate relationship with her spouse, fail to lead an appropriate parenthood, fail to communicate properly, fail to execute, fail to maintain good housekeeping. Education doesn’t automatically translate into being a good wife, a partner in health and in sickness. Education doesn’t make the woman love her husband and her children, and her household much more than uneducated woman. On the contrary an uneducated woman may have much more love in her heart than the educated one. Being together and loving one another forever isn’t about education, it isn’t about money, it isn’t about fancy and phony life style, it is about love, it is about respect, it is about tolerance, and none of that has anything to do with education. The name of the game is love, the depth and the breadth of love erases everything else on its way, the more you love your partner the less that you will have a tendency to see all of the blemishes that they have.
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Well it’s complicated but more close to be a preferences and beliefs matter, I’ve hared heard it once from a woman, “I wont let my daughters go to university, that would be better for them” without any further explanation, another said “I go to work, earn money but am not supposed (under any circumstances) to help my husband in home’s or living expenses, my money is for my entertainment only”!! SOME women have weird thoughts about education/work versus marriage life, and SOME men have these thoughts too.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">You can’t judge someone for his own belief and call him caveman and I can do that for a woman also, it’s only who are and how do you act and think.</p>
Oh and for the ‘test’ she has done, no offence <i>again </i>but that was awful, so mean and so shame to do, it was supposed to be a honest get to know<span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </span>meeting!</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">What if he was the one he told lies for ‘testing purpose’; would your mate forgive him?! Would you forgive him or write a one page post for cursing him and his tardiness, I think that is not fare.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">Thx “Devil’s Mind’ for opening my eyes on this.</p>
For Devil’s Mind and Abdullah: If I had not hinted that she did not want a PhD, you would not have known about it. I did not imagine ANYONE can shift the blame from the caveman to the girl in my class.<br /><br />Indeed it was a get-to-know-you session, which he filled with boasting about his achievements and his car, and then told the girl he does not like a woman with many degrees. She DEFINITELY knew a lot about him just through that remark. And rejected his sorry ass, meh.<br /><br />… insecure caveman.<br />
Some guys still think of that retro way! I once had an argument with a taxi driver who tried to convince me that you should marry someone 18 or younger and she shouldn’t go to school! This way, you can shape her personality to your likes and won’t have a personality of her own! And he was DEAD SERIOUS!!!</p>
<p>I disagree with those who criticized your classmate, and as a guy, I have to say; that was a fast quick test to figure out the kind of girl he’s looking for and get out while she still could.</p>
<p>And to comment on Hatem’s comment, that also applies to the man! Like you said: Partnership!</p>
I did not imagine ANYONE can shift the blame"</i> - Well, there is no crime to start with… So neither one is to "blame"!! But just like the guy had the fault of being "retro", she committed two faults. First and most important, is that she lied… Second, she is being making decisions on irrelevant issues!<br /></span></span>
I couldn’t personally put up with any sort of marriage.<br /><br />Still, I don’t think it’s accurate to assume that all men who don’t want a woman that makes a lot of money, or has a higher education level want this because they want an obedient slave. This is just too hostile.<br /><br />Some of the men I talk to with those views simply oppose women working all together, and want his wife to raise the kids as a full time job, and it really is.<br /><br />At my company, the biggest measure of hard work is how much later than the official office hours you stay behind. The other day several of us staid past 8PM, and one woman was saying its soo late, and she had to leave. A male colleague responded jokingly by saying, "so what I’m staying" to which she replied: "yeah but you’re not a mommy".<br /><br />My mom stopped working after she had the first kid, and I know my childhood wouldn’t have been the same if she didn’t. I can just imagine how I would have turned out if I was raised by my grandma, or god forbid a nanny.<br /><br />So personally I don’t mind women working as long as they don’t have kids. Am I a caveman too ?<br />
Hani, as you put it, it seems the question of a woman’s potential is only determined by the man she marries and not by her own choices.<br /><br />Women’s not being able to stay late at work and other obstacles have not been shaped by women themselves, but are rather social constraints as you well know. Therefore, they are not an indication of women’s productivity or potential.<br /><br />Where does it say, in a woman’s body, that she must take care of children and not go out to work? Arguably, women are biologically capable of carrying and giving birth to, and breastfeeding, babies. But after the first two years of a baby’s age, WHERE in a woman’s body is she OBLIGED to give up public life (career in this example) and dedicate her entire life to caring for children?<br /><br />The answer is: nowhere in a woman’s biology is she obliged to give up a career and care for children as her sole occupation. Likewise, this does not exist in a man’s body. So the question of who brings up the children is NOT a biological mandate but rather a social custom. <br /><br />Do I think you are a caveman? I do not agree with your point of view, and I definitely find it disappointing that an intelligent man such as yourself would establish a strict relationship between a female’s biology and her social status and life potential. I am honestly surprised.<br /><br /><br /><br />
She is certainly not not obliged to give up her career, I just don’t think the "super mom" who can both do well on her career, and raise the kids is all that common simply because of the time constraints. <br /><br />Aside from what you mentioned in that only a woman is capable of being pregnant, and breastfeeding, most legal systems will give custody of the child to the mother on a divorce meaning that society views the mother as more capable of child-rearing. <br /><br />So yes I agree it’s a social mandate, but not necessarily a bad one. If we apply a neutral view on which parent is more capable of raising children to the law, it means the mother doesn’t always get custody of the children by default. This is something men’s rights groups (mostly divorced fathers) have been asking for for years now. On the other hand if a woman doesn’t want to marry a man with such ideas, it is her choice. So it would be better for women not to make this argument.<br /><br />I don’t normally take society’s word for what is right and wrong, but based on observation of the men and women around me, I think women are better with kids. For instance, I always got on and learned more from my female teachers than male. <br /><br />This may be in part due to society’s expectations of women i.e. one will be taught, and will make sure they are good at playing the role society expects from them.<br />